Deb Googe and Cara Tivey - Interview

  by Eoghan Lyng

published: 17 / 4 / 2025

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Article

"Damon Albarn might not be the world's best pianist," Cara Tivey admits, "but he is very innovative in the lines he creates. His lines were always such a pleasure to play, and make complete musical sense. His music stretches me." This isn't a compliment she bandies around many of the acts she has worked with. "You have Graham making big, wild noises, like Deb and I.There's the juxtaposition in Damon's lines; that's why Blur work as a band." Tivey is one of three people on this Zoom chat. Seated in her home in London, she reflects on a career in music: "I worked as a session musician during the 1980s and 1990s.I only worked with Blur live, basically replicating Damon's brilliant keyboard lines during the Parklife era.” The other person on the call is songwriting bassist Deb Googe of My Bloody Valentine fame. It’s a curious marriage, but it’s one they realise themselves. Googe prides her upbringing as “punk through and through”, a world away from Tivey’s classical stylings. “We've been friends for about twenty years, and in that time I don't think it ever occurred to us to collaborate because we come from very different musical backgrounds,”Tivey explains. Googe nods in response, and the duo ask themselves where their idea to jam together stemmed from. Tivey has the answer: Primadonna, a literary festival aimed at women. “We've both performed there in various entities, and one time Deb came along to see me playing," Tivey says. "She suggested that I needed some 'NOISE' to go with my piano playing." I’m well aware of My Bloody Valentine’s penchant for ‘NOISE’: Loveless is effectively a smorgasbord of riffs, hooks and looped effects. Googe is set to return to Dublin later in the year to perform with My Bloody Valentine again; what is the secret to that band’s longevity? Were they ahead of the curve? “When you do these things, they're of the time,” Googe reasons. “I think Kevin developed a sort-of technique of writing and playing guitar that no one has come close to. But when you're doing something, you have no idea what will happen in the future, but you hope you're doing something with honesty and integrity. I think people get that as well. We evolved quite quickly: we had Dave in the lineup when I joined. After Dave left, Bilinda joined, and things evolved quickly. I don't know why, but from Ecstasy to Isn't Anything, the sound changed quite a lot, and changed again when we got to Loveless.” Did My Bloody Valentine inspire the compositions Chris Martin wrote for Viva La Vida? "I've no idea," she laughs. "You'd have to ask him. Some things are obvious, but I don't massively hear it with Coldplay. Most musicians I know are very open minded, and even if they don't like it all, they take it in. Inspiration comes from all over the place.” Some of the success of Loveless can be attributed to the androgyny, Googe says. "I know people who think Kevin sings one part, and it isn't," she points out. "It's Bilinda, and vice versa. There's a certain androgyny: two harmonious voices going on, and you're never quite sure which one is which. The texture and sound of the vocals is very important on [Loveless]." Googe is more interested in discussing the songs on The Golden Thread - credited to da Googie +Cara Tivey - which were done in close tandem with the pianist’s schedule."We just took it one thing at a time,” Googe highlights, “just to see if we could do anything together, because we never worked together before. I never really had anything in my mind. Each piece developed separately. I don't even think each song had an end-goal; listen to a motif, and pop in my head. The rest would grow, and edit from there. It wasn't like I was reading books on Beat poetry, or immersing myself in that, even though I have read Beat poetry." Instead, the album was stitched in a "very weird way." "All the lyrics are from personal experiences,” Googe continues. “'Dumb' is a sort of comment on the world. I didn't set out to write out about a specific thing. Cara was playing some crazy Mozart, so I called a song 'Mad Mozart'.I always had the word 'mad' at the beginning, which transformed into 'Mad Mike', which was a nickname I had for my brother. But I didn't set out to write about my brother." Googe says she "fills in lyrics with nonsense words", until the true expressions reach her, a creative exercise that stretches back to George Harrison and The Beatles. "It's pretty common," Googe nods. "I think it's a really common thing to do, fill in nonsense. And sometimes you realise it's not nonsense, as you like the line." Did they send each other ideas over the internet? No, The Golden Thread was more holistic than that. “Cara would come up to London when she could," Googe admits. "We would just get together for an afternoon every now and then, make a bit of noise, and see what came out of it. Why not?" These words are reminiscent of George Harrison's when he recalled the accidental genesis of The Travelling Wilburys: a barbecue at Bob Dylan's unwittingly led to an exciting supergroup. Harrison, like the women on Zoom,was happy to spend an evening strumming guitars; the recordings were an added bonus. "I don't think this album was influenced by anyone," Goodge elaborates. "It was inspired by having a lot of alcohol [laughs]. I do like John Cale, but it was mostly inspired by having alcohol, and saying to Cara, 'What you need on that beautiful, classical piano is a load of noise?' She had enough drink in her to agree." Tivey uses the term "free-form improvisation" to discuss the album. "We didn't necessarily have a pulse, and some of the pieces don't have a beat, but a life of their own," she continues. "It's been an absolute head.." She stops before the "f-bomb." "I've had to relearn the material, and notate it, because Deb has put them in different and unnatural places. She's structured them differently, so it has been a bit of a journey; learning the pieces like a session player. It's all good, and we’ve cracked them live now." The Golden Thread is the sound of two artists aiding one another to create another dimension of sound. One of the standouts, ‘Rant’, is fuelled by anarchy and rebellion, as if saluting the punk musicians of bygone times. If this interview is anything to go by, it might extend to younger generations of women. "I came up through punk and the ethos, and knew strong women,” Googe chips in. “So, I wasn't part of that commercial world, but I think it has shifted, but I do think there is still work to be done in the music world. People like Madonna took control of her career; the forerunner to people like Beyoncé." That layer of "no bullshit" can be felt in those younger artists. Ruminating on a question (“Has the music industry changed for women?”), Googe looks around her room, before answering precisely and clearly. "It's changed a bit," she says, pointing to the likes of Beyoncé and Taylor Swift. "They have a control over their success that wasn't there thirty years ago. Certainly, there's been some change." Googe throws the question to Tivey, who shakes her head. "I never really felt it," Tivey smiles. "I never felt that I was discriminated against, or less opportunities. I was in quite a competitive area of music where you stood or fell on your musicianship. I was a trained musician, so I came at it from a very different perspective. I wasn't making a political statement by being a female musician." She says she was successful in her auditions, and was "competing against people." Filling out a questionnaire on International Women's Day led the pianist to feel "out of [her]depth", but concedes that it "probably is harder" for women songwriters searching for a creative space "than it is for a bloke." "For me personally, I never considered it, and I worked with the Au Pairs, who were very political." She quotes one of their lyrics: "Equal but different.." Ultimately, she came at it "from a different place" and it wasn't something she "ever considered", feeling her standpoint was to "compete" and "be successful." Going back to Damon Albarn, the video for ‘Dumb’ is accompanied by a striking, colourful video, almost in the style of Gorillaz. "Deb does hide her light under a bush, Eoghan," the piano player explains. "She is multi-skilled on the media front. For starters,she's taken all the raw materials from our sessions and has created an album; I think she's an alchemist. She has an innate ability to create ideas out of what has been created." "I made it [the video] and it's taken from loads of..." The bassist stops herself: "My words are going a lot today." "Public domain," Tivey chips in. Googe smiles: "I went through a lot of public domain cartoons with certain things in mind. I started with an idea, and took little bits and pieces out, and edited them in. It's quite a lengthy thing to do, but luckily I like watching cartoons." The bass player consults the pianist: "Is ‘fitted 'a word?" "It is," Tivey assures her. "You're doing very well with your words,Deb." There is laughter, before the bassist assures us that “seven-letter-words” will follow. "There are accompanying visuals to our live shows which Deb has created,” Tivey is happy to espouse. “She's an engineer, a producer, and creates the atmosphere around our set with. I feel my contributions are a quarter of it by playing these motifs, and then Deb, by a strange magical force, brings it all together which we can perform; an entity." "You can see why I like having Cara in interviews," chuckles Googe. "The great thing about working with Deb is that it is so open,” Tivey continues. “So many frequencies, and as a musician who listens acutely to what I'm playing, it's bountiful. And that's the word I would use." Listening to ‘The Longest Wait’ and ‘Secret Place’, there is a discordancy that feels like something Wendy Carlos would have played on A Clockwork Orange. A fair comment? "I have no idea,” Tivey grins. “It's my own style. I've always loved jazz since I was a child; listening to my parents' collection. Old school jazz, but I have played pop, so there is some in there. All of that has informed my sound, so it does sound a bit classical, and sounds a bit 'this-and-that'.” What she does know is that Tivey was in awe of her collaborator during the two year writing process, clearly amazed at the transformation from raw, rollicking interludes to polished, cohesive works of rock. A jam would last "twenty minutes" before the artists "moved on" to another idea, but as the numbers maintain a palatable length - five minutes, or under - the editing helped shape the work. "Sometimes when they were formed," Deb says."The overdubs were more structural: playing guitar and bass to put it together. I never played bass in a conventional way when we played together, as it was more textural, or noises. I never played it like an actual bassline during the sessions. I set up a soundscape, and Cara would play around it." Sounds like a procedure worthy of Brian Eno's attention. "I saw that 24-hour documentary he did recently," the bassist giggles. "Not all of it, but it's fascinating; a good documentary." The duo performed "some gigs last year", and even conducted a live radio session that "seemed to go quite well." "It's just the two of us onstage," Tivey beams. "We're very lucky these days, as looping brings new sounds," Googe elaborates. "As long as someone puts a piano onstage, it's very easy for me," Tivey laughs. Considering how much they enjoy working together - neither were sure that an album was going to evolve out of the meet-ups, let alone one as strong as The Golden Thread - neither will rule out a sequel album. "There's a lot of untapped material that Deb hasn't had a chance to listen to yet,” the pianist confirms. “The world is our oyster, and we could go back into the studio and start again. I hope to work together again." What about a trip to Ireland? "Want to invite us?" Googe jokes. "I love playing Ireland. I've played Drogheda, and Dublin, and Cork. I did a little tour there, and would happily go back with Cara." "I love playing in Ireland," Tivey agrees. "I have a lot of friends in Ireland." With any luck, da Googie + Cara Tivey will have lots of new fans too!

Band Links:-

https://www.dagoogie.com/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debbie_G
https://www.instagram.com/googoogiegoo
https://www.carativey.com/
https://www.facebook.com/carativey
https://www.instagram.com/carativey

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